Lara Schmosiman (00:00)

Hi everyone, welcome back to coffee number five. And my coffee is ready as usual. Today I was thinking about being that girl, that girl that was a geek. And it was a geek and also it was things that girls don’t do and girls don’t talk. I have a story to tell you that when my parents, I think I was like eight or nine and they bought my first Atari. And they…

 

someone to connect the Atari to the TV. It took days and my anxiety couldn’t even wait for it so by the time that the guy arrived the Atari was working already and connected. My mom freaked out so much that I did myself. She was afraid that something will explode. Well…

 

Lara Schmosiman (00:47)

That was just the beginning. And that’s why I proudly say that I’m still a geek, but my geekiness has changed in different directions. I don’t play with cables so much anymore, but I play in the digital world. And it’s so amazing when I meet other women that they’re into technology, but I’m not talking about gimmicks and I’m talking about the AI because we all see that there is so much. it’s like, if I see one bit.

 

a child and adult picture and how people change over years, I don’t want that anymore. I want serious AI technology that will help us grow. So today I wanted to introduce you to Kat. Hi Kat, how are you?

 

Kat (01:30)

Hello, hi Lara, great. Thank you so much for having me. I’m excited.

 

Lara Schmosiman (01:34)

I’m excited to have you. mean, I’ve been talking to Kat by email for a long time and then we’d run into each other saying an event and it was, I know you. And it was so nice to get to, to, be with someone in person. So Kat, tell me a little bit about you and how did you get from being that girl to creating Ground AI?

 

Kat (02:00)

Yeah, ooh, I feel like my path is a little bit atypical. I actually started in the entertainment industry. So I was a television and film actress. Yeah, so I worked for close to 10 years and I was part of like a French television show. It’s still playing on TV Saint-Claude in Quebec, but also in different parts of Europe.

 

Kat (02:24)

⁓ so I, I really leaned in there and then, ⁓ when I, it’s interesting because a lot of the experiences that I’ve had, whether it was like me working in entertainment or I was also a singer, I was like the opening act for Young Money at a certain point in time, like Nicki Minaj, Drake, like that label. ⁓ so it was, it was a long time ago, but,

 

I was also, yeah, an artist, like an independent recording artist. And the ways that I found success and being able to like manage my own career, because, you know, my parents, they were engineers and architects, like they had no idea about the arts. A lot of it was like understanding growth and how do you grow a fan base? How do you almost think of yourself as a product ⁓ and find different platforms to grow?

 

Lara Schmosiman (03:10)

Mm-hmm.

 

Kat (03:14)

your fan base and therefore like your own revenue. And so I was very early on YouTube, like in 2006. And I loved like the whole idea of keywords and creating a community online. And so this was like way before even like pay per click, like advertising and Google. Yeah.

 

Lara Schmosiman (03:33)

I mean, this is so

 

important what you’re saying here besides the keywords that I’m a big fan, but also it’s about identifying trend and realize that, hey, there is something here. Being a first adopter, it’s really important.

 

Kat (03:47)

Yeah.

 

Exactly. And it wasn’t so much the technology. was more so like, wait a second. There’s an opportunity where I don’t need to have an agent to negotiate press rights for me because yes, I can be a part of a magazine shoot or I can go on the internet and have fans in Germany or in, I had fans like in South Africa, right? Like things that I couldn’t do through traditional media where like my co-stars that were a part of the same TV show.

 

they just didn’t really like think of, right? Like they were thinking so much about their careers from a traditional lens. Whereas I was thinking, well, I have the internet at my fingertips. So how do I make sure that I grow my career in the best way possible? And just thinking outside the box. And sometimes you have to. I was the only minority or the first minority in that entire network.

 

And so I didn’t actually have press rights because there was a limitation in my contract. And so sometimes you have to be scrappy and find opportunities and be like, well, if I can’t change this, there’s other things that I can do. And that’s, yeah.

 

Lara Schmosiman (04:57)

Exactly. there is always a

 

loophole in the middle, that gray area as we get new technologies. So that’s something you need to learn on that. And I always give this example that when I started doing marketing for others, as we started as a company doing social media, the beginning was we’ll do five posts a week for Facebook and this many for YouTube. then it’s one, no, the algorithm doesn’t work that.

 

Kat (05:01)

Yeah.

 

Lara Schmosiman (05:24)

anymore, but we were so locked in a contract and that we couldn’t get out of it and it wasn’t in the benefit of my client. And I cannot do a contract every time a change in post. So how did you go from there to Ground AI?

 

Kat (05:24)

Right.

 

Yes.

 

Yep. Yep, exactly.

 

There’s a lot of, I would say like a lot of things in my life that I did. mean, I’ve had many careers from like arts, but I went to business school. So I went to McGill University and I always knew I was gonna be an entrepreneur. I just didn’t know what. And so I ended up triple like majoring in finance, information systems and marketing because I knew like,

 

Well, I need to be good at numbers. need to understand how to like manage my finances. I need to be good at marketing to be able to like take products to market. And then information systems for me, was more like, maybe I’m not going to be an engineer myself. I’m not going to be a developer, but like, I want to be able to speak in systems. And at least like, if I have a team of, of like engineers, like I need to understand logic.

 

Lara Schmosiman (06:29)

I mean,

 

I’m so glad that you were able to do that. When I started in digital, there was nobody to teach it you.

 

Kat (06:36)

Yeah. Yeah.

 

Lara Schmosiman (06:37)

Well, I end up teaching

 

1. But anyway, the thing is that I really had to learn from other people. And a lot of things that you learn, you learn it like with street slang. You don’t learn it the same way that you learn it in college. And then it was like when people started going to college and they would start putting things in words of what was what, they were coming and talking to me and I was like, what’s that?

 

Kat (06:47)

Yes, yes.

 

Right.

 

Lara Schmosiman (07:03)

I

 

to explain it, that’s what you mean. And it was funny. mean, now we live in a more understandable world that we use the same words for everything.

 

Kat (07:14)

Exactly. And it’s interesting because when I first started at McGill, I wanted to intern at a very large beauty company, one of the biggest beauty companies in the world. And I went through all the rounds and I remember they made me in like the case studies, they made me do like I had to write a commercial for a lipstick, like a luxury lipstick. And

 

at the end of the day, they were like, okay, like you’re so fantastic and blah, blah, blah. But like, what does your experience have anything to do with this? And I was like, you just made me write a commercial. I have 10 years experience actually starring in commercials. Whereas like you should be absolutely hiring me when like I have industry domain knowledge. I’ve been doing marketing from a different lens as an actress. So I have 10 years experience after like before anyone has even entered the job.

 

Lara Schmosiman (08:01)

Yeah.

 

Kat (08:06)

you know, workforce. And I remember they had a lot of like hesitancy where I called them out. Like I was speaking to the VP of HR and she was like saying all these nice things. And I said, look, it doesn’t seem like you’re going to hire me. So tell me why. And she was like, whoa, like taking it back, you know, like it’s very direct. And she was like, I just don’t understand what your YouTube and your portfolio of like digital channels has anything to do.

 

with beauty or marketing. And I was like, this is the future of marketing. Influencer, creator economy did not exist. And I remember at the time, it was 2008 when I was already working with Levi’s for them to send me jeans and I would create these fake commercials on YouTube with the jeans. That was an early, that was influencing. ⁓

 

Lara Schmosiman (08:59)

It’s crazy

 

how narrow-minded some people are, still are. When I was teaching at the point and I decided that I wanted to go back to work full-time.

 

Kat (09:03)

Yeah.

 

Lara Schmosiman (09:11)

and I talked to a recruiter in the space and I gave her my resume that was all over the place. was starting entertainment as a producer and a journalist and then I moved into distribution and then I moved into digital and this recruiter told me, well, honey, you better stay home because someone with your background that you didn’t, we didn’t go straight in the ladder at your age.

 

your nanny is gonna make more money than you. ⁓

 

Kat (09:41)

my goodness.

 

my god.

 

Lara Schmosiman (09:42)

And this

 

is a true story and that’s what the recruiter said, but you know what? Payback is a beep because not that long ago she called me to see if she can place the box for me. And I was like, no, someone who told me that and that they don’t have like, you’re not thinking outside the box. didn’t see my potential that I can contribute to others. And believe me, she made me cry for a few days.

 

Kat (09:45)

Wow.

 

Yes, yeah.

 

Right.

 

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Because it really makes you question, right? Because it makes you question, but then I always go back to that to be like, well, they were right, right? Like at the end of the day, it’s like when you are an innovator and you see things differently, there’s no way or no point for you to even work in those spaces because

 

it’s not going to do your skill set, your talent, like your creativity justice. So in many ways it’s a blessing, but definitely in the short term, it’s jarring because you’re like, wait, what does this mean?

 

Lara Schmosiman (10:43)

It makes

 

you question your… It’s the opposite of a validation of who you are and what you’re capable for and of. And when you are in that position that you need a job or you want a job, it makes you feel, my God, what’s happening to me? Nothing that I did is worth it. And those people that they cannot…

 

Kat (11:01)

Right.

 

Lara Schmosiman (11:03)

read a non-linear path and how it can contribute what you learn in one space to learn in another space or even motherhood. learn I’m a better leader because I’m my mother.

 

Kat (11:16)

Yes, yes.

 

Lara Schmosiman (11:17)

There are so many things like that.

 

But let’s go back to your story. I really want to get to ground AI because it’s ⁓ a product that you have created. And I really say that, and I talk to a lot of my clients and I talk a lot about this, that the funnel has changed. The funnel is not straight anymore. We have side funnels and I found ground AI being able to connect to the funnel, but as a side part, which is fantastic. So again.

 

Kat (11:24)

Yes.

 

Right.

 

Lara Schmosiman (11:49)

we cannot be linear in our funnels anymore.

 

Kat (11:53)

Right, right, exactly. So, I mean, fast forward to, went, I worked in consulting, worked with very large corporations, but it was really at the Boston Consulting Group, so BCG. There was a venture studio where I was working with a lot of different corporations, but not as a consultant, but rather I was the head of growth for a lot of their different startups that we would incubate. So I worked with Esselora Luxotica.

 

I worked with, there was American Express, OXO, and so we would create a lot of these startups with them. And I was in charge of taking them from like zero to one and really understanding like, what is the go-to-market? How are we going to launch these products? And whether it’s, know, the every single channel, what channels are going to work? How do we…

 

understand the early unit economics and ensure that growth is scalable and there’s product market fit once we actually launch these companies. And so it was really interesting because it allowed me to essentially build companies without taking the risk. And only when I really understood the growth playbook is when I said, you know what, like,

 

this isn’t repeatable anymore. Like the world is changing. There’s technological shifts that keep happening, whether it’s iOS 14 changes, privacy, or ads just not being as effective, Google versus Meta versus social versus influencers. Like things were just happening so fast that I thought to myself, like there has to be a better way to actually grow a company.

 

Lara Schmosiman (13:27)

It’s so crazy because you don’t know where the ROI is coming from anymore.

 

Kat (13:32)

Right.

 

Right, exactly. And so a lot of what was happening as a growth marketer myself and as like an owner of these businesses was like, one plus one is not equal to two. And all of these softwares and technologies exist. But at the end of the day, like, I can spend all my budget on these softwares and these technologies and these methods, but I still don’t know if I’m going to, you know, grow. And

 

Lara Schmosiman (13:55)

Yeah.

 

Kat (13:55)

That was quite the existential question for me, where I was like, if things keep happening this way, companies are not gonna want to innovate, and they’re not gonna be able to take those risks because they can’t afford to, which ended up actually happening, right? Like BCG, yeah.

 

Lara Schmosiman (14:10)

But let’s break this down a little bit because

 

I want to explain to our audience that many times as marketers, we need to go for a bigger audience, a broader audience, and then it gets smaller and smaller and smaller and we lose them at some point. That they don’t convert. So the important here is to understand where we are losing our perspective client or customer.

 

Kat (14:25)

Great.

 

Yeah, absolutely. mean, when we think about a traditional funnel, you’re driving people to a site or landing pages. And what was going on is like you were optimizing all these different pages and clicks and thinking that, OK, like if I optimize these things and I test or if I use these tools, then I’m going to be able to solve for greater conversion. But

 

everything, every single part of the funnel is broken, where you don’t have predictability about really anything anymore.

 

Lara Schmosiman (15:06)

And you

 

don’t have interconnectability because you don’t know who comes from, know, a lot of people might come to your website from Instagram, but you don’t know who converted and who you lost in the process.

 

Kat (15:19)

Right, exactly. And then every single person that’s coming from a different channel wants a different experience. And I think we’ve been talking about this for the last 20 years about personalization. And I feel like every five years there’s a new wave. But this is the first time since the start of the internet that there truly is the capability to personalize for every single person. And I remember

 

with the advances of predictive AI in 2015, like this was a very hot topic, but with generative anticipatory AI and with better, it’s not just large language models, but the ability for there to be more learnings and faster learnings across systems is why personalization is actually possible.

 

and why the entire industry is excited. Whether you’re a brand that is starting off, you can be a Gentic first, you can be AI native first. Or if you’re also a large corporation, like I know American Eagle, for example, has talked a lot about their AI adoption journey and why personalization at scale is possible now.

 

Like these pilots are actually working because the technology has made it possible. ⁓

 

Lara Schmosiman (16:44)

Let’s,

 

but you just made a point really important. Like we’re talking about AI now, like it’s a boom. We’ve been using AI for a long time and people weren’t talking about this. This is for you or for me, it’s not a new conversation, but it’s right now I see that there is an overuse of AI. And how do you feel like this overuse of AI is affecting and is it creating noise or is it creating opportunities?

 

Kat (17:03)

Yes.

 

I think both. I think that,

 

I would say in the world of marketing, it created a lot of opportunities a couple of years ago, again, with predictive AI. understanding the customer and understanding, okay, machine learning, right? If this person buys this, then what are they going to buy next? But I think now the question is with generative AI,

 

there’s a lot more ability for us to create and create at scale, but it’s also changing algorithms. So it’s changing how we grow. So before you didn’t really need, it’s changing the data, it’s changing the amount of data. So the entire way that we even like operate as creative teams is changing. But at the same time, to your point, is, there has been a lot of noise because

 

Lara Schmosiman (17:46)

Yes.

 

but also is changing the data.

 

is

 

Kat (18:05)

It’s like, what is AI and what is not AI? And at the end of the day, it’s not even about the technology. It’s like, what is going to solve my problem? My existing problem? Where is our opportunity? what do I use? And the answer is not always like, I need AI. It’s just first principles thinking. And I would say that the variables are changing as well. But I would…

 

I would say that it’s important to work with companies that are AI native from the very beginning because a lot of solutions that have existed for 10 years are now saying, we’re AI. And it’s like, no, they’re not.

 

Lara Schmosiman (18:41)

Yeah, they’re not.

 

But you know what? This is a conversation I was having with you and your team because I use for some clients, GrownEye as a platform and I love it and I see a lot of potential growth, but at the same time, it’s not for every brand at every given time.

 

I’ve had something that I want to bring here to the table because I see that first of all, I see a lot of noise lately on the platform size in the plot.

 

plugins. First of all, your tech stack, what are you using? Sometimes you’re using too much and everything now is about your domain authority and how clean that communication is from all the channels and the narrative because AI is picking it up all of the things. And if you’re contradicting yourself or you’re not sending the same message, you create a very confusing narrative.

 

Also, I see, for example, a lot of people putting tons of money on Media By and they are not targeting right. So there’s so many, and now we have all these platforms. we have…

 

the right thing for the right company at the right time. So that’s something that I always say that brands and companies need to work with someone who really can optimize their tech stack and know when to bring the platform or when to wait.

 

Kat (19:53)

Yes.

 

Absolutely, and I would say because we work with hundreds of companies at different stages, but really when you’re starting, the most important thing is brand. It’s not even technology. It’s not optimization. It’s have you created something for a big enough market and are you getting in front of the right people that want to buy? Because

 

That’s you building and finding product market fit within a very competitive space. So it’s not just the quality of the product, it’s are you creating emotions? Are you creating a differentiation? Why do people want to buy from you? And what does that change? Then you can really think about optimizing with technology or like

 

growing the business. I think that often, sorry, go ahead.

 

Lara Schmosiman (20:54)

no no no I was thinking about a word came to my head like TikTok ability that’s a new word out there and we have Instagram ability and so you need to see if really really you need first to

 

Kat (21:00)

Yeah.

 

Lara Schmosiman (21:10)

analyze and if your brand is going to even perform there, if you have an opportunity because there are other places you don’t need only TikTok to be successful you need to know where your brand has the most potential.

 

Kat (21:14)

Exactly. Yes.

 

Great.

 

Yes, exactly, exactly. And so that is going to dictate the rest. But for you to even get there, you need to first understand, what is your unique opinion and where are you successful? Because, sometimes it’s not even TikTok or Instagram. Maybe it’s more like on a wholesale or like spas or like, I have no idea. But ultimately, the way that you market is the way that you find that early adoption.

 

Lara Schmosiman (21:53)

Mm-hmm.

 

Kat (21:54)

and success

 

and then also like it it boils down to like your own ability right so i think that some people can speak tiktok language so like comfortably because it’s a part of their daily life if that’s not you then like that’s totally fine then don’t force it you don’t need to force something that like doesn’t work

 

Lara Schmosiman (22:14)

For

 

in TikTok, because it’s just such a visual platform, you need to show products that you can clearly see a before and after, that it’s an explainer, something that you can show. Like for example, doing vitamins, I don’t know how well it will do in TikTok because it’s hard to explain. So.

 

Kat (22:27)

Right.

 

Right. And also

 

understanding the price, right? Like most brands that sell on TikTok and actually even generate income on TikTok, their price point is ⁓ lower. You know, the cap is $50.

 

Lara Schmosiman (22:37)

Yes.

 

Yes,

 

and you also know that you’re going to have to give a lot of product away and you’re going to have to do heavy discounts. So you need to decide, my margins there? Is that the perception I want from my brand? You shouldn’t be doing it because everyone is doing it. You need to do it because it’s right for your brand.

 

Kat (23:05)

Exactly, exactly. so once you’ve decided that and you’ve got into, usually it’s around a million. would say in 2025, like this last year, it’s really 2 million that you’re really finding that product market fit. have legs to stand on and now I can really grow to five. I can really grow five to 10. And that’s where technology.

 

Lara Schmosiman (23:11)

Mm-hmm.

 

Kat (23:28)

has great benefit because you have enough data for AI to make sense for the business.

 

Lara Schmosiman (23:34)

Yeah,

 

absolutely. So what you’re saying is that your technology basically you need to be in the market for a while to be able to take advantage of grand AI.

 

Kat (23:45)

I think you need to have at least a baseline of growth and data. So some brands get to, you know, 2 million in sales in 12 months. You know, some, takes them a long time, which is totally fine. But as long as you have that baseline, then you have enough site traffic. You have enough data of like customers to think about like, how do I get the

 

get them to come back and buy again? How do I make sure that I’m converting that site traffic? That’s really where we can use an AI revenue growth engine like ground AI to essentially have these different agents to find that hidden revenue within your business.

 

Lara Schmosiman (24:25)

Yeah, absolutely. So explain a little bit to our audience what’s ground AI, when is the right time to bring it in and who is it for and what does it does? Let’s make it really simple.

 

Kat (24:38)

Yeah.

 

So, so ground were an AI revenue growth engine for consumer businesses. And essentially what that means is we have different AI models and different AI agents that are scanning your business there inside of your tech stack and understand when to leverage your existing tech stack for it to convert customers across the journey.

 

So whether it’s I want to get more first time customers because they’re on my website, how do I get them to actually make a first purchase? Or is it abandonment? Like there’s a lot of data stitching that is required. And so having an AI agent that can crawl and really understand and interpret your business and say, these customers are.

 

they’re abandoning, like how do I make sure that we get them to make a purchase when they express interest and not just leave? And then finally, the bottom part of the funnel is retention. So how do I get my existing customers to go from making one purchase to a second purchase to a third and increase that lifetime value ⁓ for each customer?

 

Lara Schmosiman (25:44)

Yeah, that’s a good

 

word because right now I think that we need to stop talking about ROAS because it’s just, it’s like another of those words that everyone wants to talk about ROAS and, but no, at the end of the day it’s about retention, retention, how you make your customer lawyer to you.

 

Kat (25:49)

Yeah.

 

Right, exactly, exactly. And how do you have a healthy funnel across the entire business, right? Because ROAS is great when you’re thinking about your ad spend. But then once you have site visitors that came from those ads, it’s like how many, like CRM is important, right? Like, are you converting them to like email signups?

 

SMS signups, like do you have first party data? How much of it?

 

Lara Schmosiman (26:32)

Yeah, well, because

 

otherwise basically you are spending money on conversion and conversion and it’s a customer acquisition and you’re not retaining them in any way even if they don’t buy but they sign up to your email marketing means that they’re still interested.

 

Kat (26:52)

Exactly. And that is really important where I think that a lot of brands that are maybe more like social shopping native, they, I think that over time they realize, wait a second, even though I’m making money on TikTok shop, for example, I need to own that customer. Like I need to make sure that I understand who they are. And with agentic commerce, I believe 2026 is going to be one of those years where

 

we’re going to see more of that, right? Like direct to consumer and just owning the customer data is going to be even more important.

 

Lara Schmosiman (27:25)

So,

 

so, so important. Also, I’m gonna remind you guys out there one more time that your TikTok, you don’t own it. Your Instagram account, you don’t own it. The only thing that you really own is your website, which is your heart and the narrative that comes from that.

 

Kat (27:43)

Exactly, absolutely. I think that with Chad GPT, like larger brands, you know, I’m speaking to a lot of their CTOs and their boards and, you know, if they’re making, let’s say over a hundred million a year on just their Shopify or just their direct to consumer channel, they’re thinking about, well, wait a second, Chad GPT is a new channel and I want to make sure that people can transact directly. I think that’s fantastic.

 

⁓ However, it is another channel just like TikTok shop where you do not own the data. You’re not gonna own the data.

 

Lara Schmosiman (28:15)

It

 

is, and there is a one, it even makes it harder because in you go into SEO, you go into traditional Google and you get multiple results. ChatGPP, will give you one result or maybe two, but so you need to make sure that you really, your site is prepared for GEO and not only for the checkout, but also you need to understand who is your consumer and speak

 

Kat (28:26)

Great.

 

Lara Schmosiman (28:43)

like a consumer and what questions they will ask and how they will ask them.

 

Kat (28:49)

Exactly. And I

 

would say that even more importantly, your like e-commerce needs to be set up for the funnel to be as efficient as possible. So let’s just say someone doesn’t transact on TikTok, doesn’t transact on ChatUBT or perplexity. If they’re going to your website, you need to make sure that it’s as tight as possible that you’re converting that person very quickly.

 

So I’m all for increasing channels for top of the funnel, but it just makes it where you need to make sure that you’re still caring about that first party data, capturing that revenue on your own website and just making sure that that experience is as best designed as possible for people.

 

Lara Schmosiman (29:35)

Mm-hmm.

 

Kat (29:36)

on, you know, chat, TBT and perplexity and then beyond with AI agents because.

 

Lara Schmosiman (29:39)

I’ve seen it so many

 

times at their brands, they’re talking different languages in different platforms and that’s creating such a big confusion to AI.

 

Kat (29:48)

Yeah.

 

It is, absolutely. And also we design, I think, websites still sometimes for these very complex and beautiful experiences without really thinking about, wait a second, if I’m on my phone, let’s look at the data. If there’s over 770 million chat TV users, where will they be shopping next year? Is it on mobile? Is it on desktop? Yeah.

 

Lara Schmosiman (30:03)

Yes.

 

What?

 

was explaining

 

this to a client the other day that they wanted all this experience in the website. I was like, websites are now a window right now. Think about it. Like if you are putting your house in the market, you’re fix your house. You make it all nice. You’re even stage it, but you don’t get the real estate agent and you don’t get a sign on your door and you don’t advertise it anywhere. You don’t put it. It’s exactly.

 

same thing for your brand.

 

Kat (30:48)

Right, yeah, exactly, exactly. And I think that over time, we’re already seeing this where your site needs to be as efficient as possible and therefore you do need AI agents within it. And then over time, like, who knows where like things are moving so fast and I’ve spent a lot of time in…

 

Silicon Valley the last quarter, just to understand like, where is it going? Like where are the builders going? Not just ground, but a lot of discussion is around, well, what about AI agents, right? Like personal shoppers, because that’s really what we’re seeing across the board, right? Like if I have a personal shopper, then my personal shopper is like a robot. Like it’s not going to be.

 

The way that it perceives brand and negotiation is gonna be very different. So you need to make sure that your website is also ready for when we see more of that. And perhaps it’ll be other personal shoppers. Maybe it’ll be Chat TVT. Like who knows who’s gonna really like own that, but.

 

Lara Schmosiman (31:41)

Absolutely.

 

One of

 

the things that I think that is super, super important is that you work with a team that, and using platforms like RoundAI, like you choose whoever you want to work with, but you start the trend early on. Like you started in YouTube early on. Like I feel like brands right now, they don’t optimize their website for AI, they will be too late.

 

Kat (32:04)

Yes.

 

Exactly, exactly. Or at least it’ll be too late in the sense that all of these are arbitrage opportunities, right? Like every single technological shift has led for some superstar brands. Like Glossier was a blog, but then it was able to use ads very well. They started earlier.

 

Lara Schmosiman (32:29)

Mm-hmm.

 

Because they started earlier and it’s the

 

same companies that they started really early with website, they’re going to run better in Google if they did their job with SEO. So it’s the same now with AI. Having that authority also comes with age.

 

Kat (32:43)

Exactly.

 

Exactly, exactly. so the window, the arbitrage opportunity, it’s the smaller windows that you have. And because technology moves a lot faster and Adenta Commerce moves, like what took e-commerce 10 years we’re seeing in one, right? So the windows of opportunity for you to like really like catapult gets smaller, but that’s why you need to just make these

 

bigger bets while sustaining like 90 % of your business, right? Where it’s like 80-20, 80 % it’s like things that work. 20 % of your time should be spent on, wait a second, like maybe let me try this, because I’ve never tried this and let me take a little bit of a risk.

 

Lara Schmosiman (33:22)

Mm-hmm.

 

Hi, so let me ask you two more questions for you before we go. The first one, what do you think that it will come in 2026? What’s going to happen? And also what things we’re going to X out in 2026?

 

Kat (33:47)

So in the world that I live in with just how to grow a business, how to drive more revenue, I believe that 2026 is the year where a lot of these gimmicks like these, I’m a platform, I’ve been around for 10 years, I have these AI features. don’t think that brand founders are smart. They’re gonna look at that and they’re gonna be like, that’s AI washing.

 

Lara Schmosiman (34:11)

And the consumer

 

is getting smarter and smarter.

 

Kat (34:13)

Totally, exactly. so a lot of these companies that are maybe talking about AI will be able to demystify and say, well, no, you’re a great partner for this, but you’re not an AI first company. So.

 

Lara Schmosiman (34:30)

You’re adding an AI element into your platform or whatever you are.

 

Kat (34:33)

Right.

 

Exactly. And so I think that we’re going to not be focused on those anymore. Like I think that those are just gimmicks and add-ons that don’t really, they just add a lot of noise and confusion to founders and to go to market teams. So that that’s going to go away. and what I think will persist is

 

using AI with an actual return on investment that is clear.

 

Lara Schmosiman (35:01)

I love that. I love that because there so many gimmicks out there and they are not clear. And this is something I love about your platform that I get your team every month to let me know the return of investment and how the platform is working for us, which you don’t get out there. And as an agency, we work the same way. We are giving reporting so you can see our work.

 

Kat (35:13)

You

 

Lara Schmosiman (35:26)

and what it’s doing because sometimes it’s hard to perceive ROI from everything we’re doing, but the data is there and data doesn’t lie.

 

Kat (35:34)

Exactly, exactly. so it’s ⁓ anytime you’re going to make an investment, it’s understanding. And sometimes it’s not as clear cut as ground. I mean, we add revenue to the business. So it is very mathematical. We either generate revenue for you or we don’t. But there are other kinds of AI investments. It’s just being able to be very clear and intentional about, I’m going to spend X to do Y.

 

Is it going to be a vitamin or is it going to be a painkiller? And I think both of those are helpful. So for example, for me, generative AI can sometimes be more of a vitamin, but at the same time, perhaps it is going to be more necessary to generate more images because algorithms have changed. So you don’t need five different pieces of content. Sometimes you need 300. ⁓

 

Lara Schmosiman (36:23)

I know.

 

I know.

 

Kat (36:24)

maybe

 

that is also not just a vitamin, that is a painkiller. Things are changing, but it’s very important to ask yourself why. Why am I going to invest in this and how am I going to evaluate success and make sure that whomever, whichever partner I’m leveraging explains it.

 

Lara Schmosiman (36:40)

Yeah, exactly.

 

You’re not going to make decisions of, okay, I’m spending these 300 images arguing with the ROI.

 

Kat (36:48)

Right, yeah, exactly, exactly. And so just being very intentional and clear where it’s not just like, I’m gonna use AI because my board told me or I need AI because I don’t wanna, I’m scared. It’s more like I have all these different opportunities and even challenges. What can I use? And if AI is a solution, fantastic. Let me pilot a couple things or let me try things and see what works and what doesn’t.

 

Lara Schmosiman (37:14)

Thank you. Well before we go I have one last question for you. How do you drink your coffee cat?

 

Kat (37:18)

Yes.

 

⁓ so I drink my coffee. I have, I have, I have it right here. It looks terrible, but it, ⁓ typically it’s an iced oat latte. no sugar, just, but I, I like it to be poured very specifically. So it’s, I’m very meticulous. So I don’t like it to be shaken. It’s first you need to add the milk.

 

Lara Schmosiman (37:30)

Okay.

 

⁓ I like that. Okay.

 

Kat (37:46)

with a lot of ice and then just give me one espresso shot that is added at the top. Don’t mix it, just let it sink.

 

Lara Schmosiman (37:54)

Well, you know,

 

in Israel they call that Cafe Afukh, which means Afukh, I believe, and means upside down, coffee upside down.

 

Kat (37:58)

Kaffee afuk Afuk

 

okay, yeah. I guess that’s what I love. ⁓

 

Lara Schmosiman (38:07)

Yes!

 

Well, Kat, thank you so much for being here today. It was really, really a treat to have you.

 

Kat (38:13)

Thank you so much for having me. This was super fun.

 

Lara Schmosiman (38:15)

Yeah and to you guys I will see you next week with more coffee number five.

 

Kat (38:20)

Thank